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 The modding state of fallout 4

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conn11399

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PostSubject: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyThu Apr 11, 2019 10:17 am

So what gives with fallout 4's modding scene? One of the best parts of Fallout: New Vegas was the sheer amount of crazy long, intricate, detailed and sometimes wacky quest/adventure mods. Why has Fallout 4 seemed to skip that phase? It seems we have jumped straight to re texturing bushes and obscene sex and skimpy mods. Is it simply the shitty dialogue system? or is it because F4 lacked to stir up the passion that FNV did? Im curious to see what insight you ladies and gents have!

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyThu Apr 11, 2019 11:09 am

Not really. If anything I think the modders are even more ambitious with mods like Fallout 4: New Vegas, Fallout 4: Capital Wasteland, Fallout: Miami and Fallout Cascadia to name a few.

Plus there is Tales from the Commonwealth, America Rising(this was still an in progress mod that you can download last time I played Fallout 4 but it is good) and Fusion City.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyThu Apr 11, 2019 11:26 am

Sure! Those are really cool project but honestly a fraction of them will see a release. Abandoned ambitious projects have always been a thing with bethesda games these are no exeption. Im talking about the plethora of quest mods like Boulder Dome, Deimos, Someguy series, Rockwell Project and a massive amount of smaller short quests with quality voice acting and a story that came very soon after the release of FNV. Most of which releasing from 2011-2015.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyThu Apr 11, 2019 12:16 pm

It's mostly due to the fact that modders had to overcome various issues like the voiced dialogue framework, the perk system and other annoyances that came with the game, not that there has been a dry spot in the community which is only just being revitalized. Most of the previously mentioned projects have been working together by my knowledge to try and overcome these dilemmas. Starting a massive large-scale project using a game that does everything in it's power to stop that project from functioning fluidly is a very daunting task. I can see why it may seem a lot less straight-forward when comparing it to previous instalments which didn't suffer from the challenges that plague Fallout 4 modding.

Modders would have found it easier to start and finish quest mods back in the early Elder Scrolls instalments where there was little to no voice acting and later releases such as Oblivion may have intimidated prominent modders of the earlier games into abandoning their mod projects due to the voice acting they would now have to record in order to see a mod project function fluidly and not seem odd in comparison to the main game content. I see Fallout 4 as another stage in the evolution of Bethesda modding. It's a challenge for modders to overcome, but the passionate will eventually find a way.

Furthermore, I feel as if once those existing projects are finished, Fallout 4 will likely see a golden age in it's modding scene, much greater than that of New Vegas or Oblivion, perhaps even rivalling Skyrim. Just a shame that by the time that rolls around, it would likely be the time where everyone has just moved on from Fallout 4, either due to Starfield, Elder Scrolls VI or another Fallout game, or even distaste for 4 itself.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyThu Apr 11, 2019 12:29 pm

I'm not sure I go along completely with the premise, but there is some merit to the skimpy, sexual mods and even the texture improvement issue. That is true for all Beth games if you ask me. There are some additional quest and immersion mods that are fairly new for FO4 or recently updated. You have seen these?

https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/16423/?
https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/21469
https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/28085
https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/8704
https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/18949

There are more, but those are all updated and well done. There is also lots of game play improvements or add-ons, these are just two of them -

https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/30952
https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/17626/

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyThu Apr 11, 2019 12:46 pm

I understand what you are saying however the maybe at max 10 good quest mods available after more than 3 years is laughable compared to the amount for FNV or even Skyrim in that same time frame. While I am sure that if (by a miracle) all those projects are released within the decade that it will improve the modding scene I just dont know how it could bring it any where close to past titles. I guess the dialogue system really was a huge hindrance on the longevity of this game as so many of the mod authors that made past games and even the launch of F4 fantastic have given up with the Commonwealth.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyFri Apr 12, 2019 12:05 am

If you like skimpy armors, CBBE related stuff and some high quality weapon mods, than its going good. But in terms of story telling quality and world building mods like we got in FNV, than I say its a bust at the moment. I can't put my finger on it, but a lot of the story and quest mods just don't have that creative world building flare that the older mods like NVB series had for example. Something all just feels so shallow.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyFri Apr 12, 2019 12:15 am

@stoobygacks Not to turn this topic into a "Bash Fallout 4's lack of creativity" debate, but I would agree with this. I read Someguy2000's retelling of his encounter with Fallout 4 again recently, he said that modding is a labour of love. If you don't love Fallout 4 enough to spend hour and hours of hard work to create something for free, then you're not going to bother. New Vegas is creative by nature, thats why I think it has the best mods, especially quest mods (Never played any fallout 3 quest mods, so I can't comment). This love is put to the test, especially for modders of previous Fallout games as the framework for the game is different, and more similar to TES. Along with the voiced protagonist, it doesn't help itself at all.

Fallout 4 in general is as wide as an ocean, but as shallow as a puddle in my opinion. It should be a good game on paper, the ideas that make up Fallout's fundamentals are sound, but in execution it just didn't pan out to people's expectations. Too many video game companies take for granted the fan base that they have, and assume that they already have the attention and money from pre existing fans, and they'll eat up further releases. Therefor they try and get people who wouldn't normally play RPG's to play these games.

Not to deter, or shit on the hard work for quest mod projects that are currently on going for Fallout 4, It's just down to preference really. It is hard to love Fallout 4 as much as you want to love it.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyFri Apr 12, 2019 1:15 am

As a modder and someone who makes large complex quests. I found fallout 4’s dialogue tree increasingly irritating to work with. Added with the fact that our player now talks and a few things were moved around. It made it hard to do dynamic quests. Moreover without them being voiced added quests felt completely alien and out of place. I didn’t want to even bother with it. When Talking with some of the other main mod authors of this site, it also seems none of us had a driving desire to mod fallout 4. The fact we’ve invested so much time in fnv learning it’s system also contributed. A lot of us still had large projects for fnv in progress. Lastly in fnv our character was blank and could really be anyone, yet in fallout 4 your player is a fully grown military vet with a family and a forced over arching story. We traded a lot of the rpg style elements too. That definitely killed the creative aspect of fallout 4 and it’s mod appeal. I’m sure the system for modding fallout 4 has improved, but when I first tried, oh boy was it a disaster.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyFri Apr 12, 2019 2:18 am

If someone gets their Jets fired up to Mod the game on their own and by not remaking popular or making a whole new wasteland it will surely happen but untill then do expect The Adventures of Boobina the Buster and her truthful sidekick Smothie the Smoth for a while on the nexus as Advanced as we are as a race and any other form or means we are still primitive so yeah...Butts to the rescue I guess you cant decline the modding potential but it will be a ride thought the 9 stages of hell to get there while in FNV and Skyrie you need simply to have 12 hours extra during nighttime for dialogue lip sync...Hey anyone like nav mesh ? man thats fun

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyFri Apr 12, 2019 6:34 am

Mostly I think it's the dialog system. It makes it hard to make a grand, epic, story when your only choices are either to make the main character unvoiced with only four option that almost always force you forward, OR having the main character voiced but being forced to choose from pre-recorded dialog, and building your story around what the character can say.

Fallout 4 as a standard has a problem in the fact that there is little choice in the game. It ALWAYS forces you forward. Your choices are YES, ANGRY YES, POLITE YES, or NO (BUT SECRETLY YES).
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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyWed Apr 17, 2019 2:12 pm

I think everyone above my comment has basically answered your question, but hey might as well jump into the fray! It's been covered and talked about so much that I could regurgitate verbatim all the pitfalls and other travesties that this game has... but I'm not doing that because I'm lazy( and honestly, no one wants to read it anyways).

I play F4 every once in awhile, especially if I'm just bored. I normally start a new game, then I download all the essential ,cool, new mods that are available and have fun for a little bit. However, it's only been recently that I realized that I never finish the play through. It's just me testing new weapons and armors in a 1st/3rd person shooter sandbox. The amount of games I have started, but never finished is staggering. The story to the game is just linear to keep me enthralled, and too few quest mods to keep me entertained.

I see this problem as an issue with the overall execution of the game. Too many ideas, so few fleshed out. Voiced protagonist is the easiest example, since it hurt not only the role-play of vanilla F4, but it also hurts the creativity of quest mods. I could keep going on, but I feel like a broken record.

TL;DR
Something, something, F4 has fun combat mechanics and that is about it, something, something.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyTue Jun 18, 2019 6:02 am

fallout 4 has some limits here and there and probably we will never see wonders like frontier o new california developed for that game, still it has it's potential! Finally mods that let you have an alternate start are aviable and almost bug free, allowing you to experience playthroughs that are way more different from the one of the lone survivor and his heartly good natured quest to find that old fart of his son. Projects like sim settlements: conqueror let you shape the wastelands in the way you prefer and so on.
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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptySat Jul 06, 2019 9:34 pm

From my experience, modding for TES and FO has excalated into some virtual sex fantasy thing, where the skimpy, slutty and nude contents has taken over. But dig through all that and go deeper, then you find mods that actually makes your time in the game more enjoyable, wether its lore-friendly or not.

But I do agree that some more story-rich mods with a long quest-line and voice acting would be great, probably why Bethesda launched the Creation Club, and offer to pay modders for their mods, but then again, you'd have to purchase that mod in order to use, so its both positive and negative in some ways.

But at the end of the day, i think its up to the community to encourage modders to make these story-rich voiced quest mods, so that they feel its actually worth their time and hard work.

Unfortunatly, there are too many people, specially on Nexus that rather bitch and whine and crap over modders work and expect mods to be free as if its their right to get free mods. Which they obviously gotten backwards.

So I think a big reason to why these awsome mods hasn't surfaced yet, is that modders may lack the proper support and incentive to put down all the time and hard work the mods would require, without sacrificing their private life ofcourse.

As an amateur modder muself, I also find modding for FO4 for example to be alot more tricky and complex than working with FO3/FNV editing tools.

I ain't got much to show for myself, but I do try to respect and endorse modders for their hard work. Sadly, I also see alot of posts on (on Nexus for example) and other places, where people are just douchebags in their feedbacks to mod authors.

But I wouldn't say FO4 lacks in cool mods, but atleast to me it is more complex to mod for than FO3/FNV and it may just be that many others think the same, and therefore, FO4 don't get the same indepth mod making as Fo3/FNV had.

Ofcourse this is just my opinion and view of things, I could be wrong.
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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyMon Jul 08, 2019 7:37 am

Anything that requires the main character to speak is going to be tough to mod in a complex manner. Either rely on un-voiced player dialogue, or recycle the simplistic yes/no stuff from the game.

Maybe with a brand-new protagonist we might see something close to new california someday, but that only recently released, and how many years after New Vegas? We have a while to wait if the same modding timeline holds true for Fallout 4.

But outside of this limitation, Fallout 4 mods have done a few amazing things, especially Sim Settlements. And companion mods can be as well-made as any other game.

I know why they went with a voiced protagonist, or why someone might think it was a good idea, but the writing was simplistic for the main character.
Me? I can't even imagine my commander Shepard without the voice, now. "Report to the ship, we'll bang, ok?"

Geralt wasn't the most vibrant voice acting, but I am still glad I heard the voice. But yeah, it's different when you're trying to make your own character.
I liked it in Dragon Age inquisition too, although maybe I got lucky that the voice just felt so right for the first character I made.

Though it's not an rpg, I really enjoyed Laura Bailey's voice for my protagonist in Saints Row 3 and 4 -- "oh fuck me" as I get hit by a truck and bounce off three skyscrapers high above the city. Wouldn't have been the same with just text flashing on the screen. "Nice view."

I don't remember my fallout 3 character, surprisingly -- but I remember some of the npcs and their actor's performances. I worry I've been hit in the head.

I admit fallout 4's choice of a voiced protagonist falls flat if you're trying to play a screaming lunatic raider or something. Again I think I got lucky and the voice was fine for my character.
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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyWed Jul 10, 2019 1:04 am

I thought the protagonist voice was a bit wierd and in soem dialogs too... Yesterday I got to Beacon/Bunker Hill (Forgot the name closed eyes smile) trading settlement for the first time and got this dialog where they ask me why I'm there, and my protagonist started screaming at her "I'M lOOKING TO TRADE", she was literally justa few inches away from me and my protagonist screams as if she has a hearing problem... So yes, sometimes the game acts really wierd when it trieds to regongnize your distance from the NPC your speaking with. In some way it can actually be amusing I guess...

Still think they should have given us a choice of type of voice, like in the oldschool rpg games such as Baldurs Gate, Neverwinter Nights etc, to add more immersion to the type of character you wanna play as that fits better.
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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyWed Jul 10, 2019 2:26 am

Baldur's gate could give a choice of voice because there were only a few shouts and grunts.
Still, the sometimes maligned dragon age inquisition offered multiple voice choices, so yeah, fallout 4 should have as well. I mean, if by some chance bethesda actually wants to stay competitive, which I'm not sure they do.
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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyWed Jul 10, 2019 10:19 am

I seem to remember there being a mod that fixed the complaints about only 4 options for dialogue. I think it's being used as a requirement for the big projects because it's infinitely better than what we got in vanilla.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyWed Jul 10, 2019 11:11 am

The problem with a mod that fixes complaints is, people still feel disencouraged. They’d have to use a third party just to make what they are aiming to accomplish happen. Having to DL someone else’s mod just to make modding tolerable doesn’t sound so pleasant. Unless they’ve set it up akin to the nvse starter.

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PostSubject: Re: The modding state of fallout 4   The modding state of fallout 4 EmptyWed Jul 10, 2019 11:17 am

@Tank-Girl wrote:
The problem with a mod that fixes complaints is, people still feel disencouraged. They’d have to use a third party just to make what they are aiming to accomplish happen. Having to DL someone else’s mod just to make modding tolerable doesn’t sound so pleasant. Unless they’ve set it up akin to the nvse starter.

I think it's XDI (https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/27216/). It does require F4SE to function and seems to be easy to implement. Though I can understand the fact that it's needed can be frustrating. Hopefully Bethesda realized 4 options was a mistake.

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