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 who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?

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falloutgods69



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:03 pm

I think Benny would've overthrown Mr. House and taken complete control of Vegas. Without the Courier's intervention Benny's plan would've gone very smoothly. I wonder what a Benny lead NV would look like?
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mindstormer



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:09 pm

@falloutgods69 wrote:
I think Benny would've overthrown Mr. House and taken complete control  of Vegas. Without the Courier's intervention Benny's plan would've gone very smoothly. I wonder what a Benny lead NV would look like?

He would still be caught at the fort trying to upgrade the securitrons, or not?

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AdotLOM



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:37 pm

@ZDC14 wrote:
We also see Legion fighters using 12.7mm submachine guns, and the base legion soldiers often use cowboy repeaters which are way more effective against armor than service rifles.
I agree with the majority of what you said, but;

Just because it does more damage in game, doesn't mean it would in reality. 5.56 might not have as much stopping power as .357, but it can also pierce armour better. Studies may say that it cannot kill effectively, but it was easily solved with a focus on center-mass shots. Also, many NCR troops use salvaged weapons too, and legionaries using advanced firearms like 12.7mm SMG's and AMR's would be few and far in between (equivalent to how, historically, only officers in western militaries carried a sidearm).

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alonewolf003



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 1:01 am

@Funshine wrote:
Interesting question...

If the courier died in Goodsprings Benny would have the platinum chip. But Since the Securitrons are in their hidden vault he'd have to go through ceasar's camp. If he gets captured like in the game then the Legion will get access to the Securitrons and they will win.
If Benny isn't captured and gets the securitron army he could win the fight.

IIRC If you sided with the NCR you would be sent throughout the wasteland in hopes of getting support for the NCR. If someone else did this the NCR would be a worthy enemy for either Benny or the Legion. Especially if they can get the boomers to blow ceasars army to bits. Smile

The Legion doesn't know what the platinum chip is for nor how to use them lol, if they mess around with it and insert it wherever they can inside that vault then Mr.House would still get it because that's what basically the Courier did. The vault itself got a bunch of Protectron and Sentry bots, the sentry bots alone can probably wipe the entire Legion camp (there were like, 4 in there?).

Everyone also forgot the fact that the Legion's numbers this time will be greater because they got help and reinforcements from tribes all over + new Legate's in command.

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ayylmao22



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 5:14 am

Again, NCR would make the Legion their new toliet if General Oliver wasn't such a shit general and actually made use of the Rangers, vertibirds, and troops to fucking invade the fort instead of his "wait and don't make any moves" tactic.

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PoisonEliteGaming



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 8:39 am

NCR, more soldiers, better equipped than Legion. Overall they're just a powerhouse which has been standing since Fallout 1. If they wanted to they could bring out the big guns, after-all this isn't their main territory so they aren't running at 100%

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djadamson



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:57 am

I also think the NCR would win, they have a greater army, a lot better weapons than the legion and they are probably more efficient with tactics and strategies. Also they have salvaged power armour and machetes and throwing spears are just going to bounce off them Smile
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Nurwhal



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:13 am

The NCR would win easily, it's like bringing a spear to a gunfight. But for real. The NCR has better training and gear, the legions gear is inferior compared to NCR's. I doubt there's much a sword could do against Power Armour and their Armour doesn't look like it could withstand much damage. Even the Centurions, who have probably the most heaviest armour. But in terms of toughness, I'd give it to the legion. Even if they did take a bullet, they would carry on until death. But if they had more weaponry, and more advanced tech. They'd win.

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damcall



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 1:07 pm

In a straight shoot out, I do believe the NCR would win. However the fear factor would play a part on the battlefield. The legions use of psychological tactics could favor Caesar, also resources are steadily depleting for the NCR. If The Legion gained more support from local tribes, I think it would be over for the NCR.

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Svide



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 2:55 pm

NCR, cause if they can take most of the BrotherHood f steel down they can take the legion down too. Strength is in numbers people.

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oldboy



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 3:12 pm

@AdotLOM wrote:
@oldboy wrote:
As much as i hate the legion, im gonna have to agree with this. NCR cant even protect their trade routes from fiends and other bandits. in fact, they couldnt even take care of dangerous fiend members without the couriers help...cook-cook, motorhead, violet etc.
I've been thinking about this, but who's to say that the Courier is the only person capable of, for example, taking the bounty of the Fiend leaders?

doubt it. even the 1st recon guys couldn't take them out...atleast without the couriers help.
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MomoTheTerminator



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 3:45 pm

The Legion obviously! fuck the ncr!

just kidding Wink

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Sklone



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 4:51 pm

I would say legion the ncr might have the hear but they are sloppy the legion are very disciplined if they fail to do what they were ordered they are killed and that can go along ways plus they have nothing to lose really so they would be pretty damn vicous

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Flavio01997



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 4:59 pm

If you put how many thing you can do for helping the NCR againts the Legion, the Legion would totally win.
The moral of the NCR is already under their feet, then put the assassination of Kimball during his speech, no Boomers helping with the carpet bombing on the B29, no BoS and Enclave soldiers...
Even the equipment is better on Legion side, stronger weapons (but not stronger armors, NCR have power armors from the Helios One battle)

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MWguitarist



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 6:07 pm

The courier has so much effect on this its kind of ridiculous to think about. If you put it just between the NCR and the legion, I'd have to agree on the Legion taking over. Maybe if they had help from other tribes, and the fact that NCR are spread out very thin and running low on many resources. My money's on the Legion.
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SuperDuperMutant



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 6:51 pm

As has been said, the Legion is the more likely to win the second battle for Hoover Damn. Most of the quests NCR side have you bringing together allies and disrupting the legion so the NCR has a better shot. Without the Courier none of this gets done.

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jkdsh



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 6:54 pm

Really? People are actually saying the legion would win?
They have what, two types of legionaries that carry guns and even then they're usually shotguns or handguns and the occasional hunting rifle? Yes, numbers are important, but, so is having an equalized amount of technology and weaponry. The NCR could literally send two vertibirds and the Legion would be boned, a heavily armored airborne vehicle with missiles and miniguns, that leather football armor will definitely save them from that, right? That leads into the next part, armor, NCR troops have everything from riot armor with what appears to be armor plating on the front to power armor, those swords would sure be effective against a literal walking tank...
The NCR has pretty much every type of weapon under the sun aside from energy weapons: .50 cals, rocket launchers, anti-aircraft guns, miniguns, large caliber handguns, shotguns, the legion uses powerfists, machetes, bumper swords, occasionally small arms, and ballistic fists. Aside from numbers, the Legion is entirely outclassed.

NCR Advantages:
1. Huge amounts of weapons.
2. Serious training.
3. Better armor.
4. Snipers.
5. Vertibirds.
6. The people of the Mojave Wasteland seem none to fond of the Legion.
7. They know the territory.
8. Better, bigger, weapons.

Legion Advantage:
1. Numbers.
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themaster96



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 7:06 pm

Well i have to bet on NCR too, they are better organized, have better training and better equipment and in a world with nuclear bombs and weapons of mass destruction numbers dont matter so yeah the NCR would win, they have alreday won one time and would probably won again
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PoisonEliteGaming



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 7:15 pm

@jkdsh wrote:
Really? People are actually saying the legion would win?
They have what, two types of legionaries that carry guns and even then they're usually shotguns or handguns and the occasional hunting rifle? Yes, numbers are important, but, so is having an equalized amount of technology and weaponry. The NCR could literally send two vertibirds and the Legion would be boned, a heavily armored airborne vehicle with missiles and miniguns, that leather football armor will definitely save them from that, right? That leads into the next part, armor, NCR troops have everything from riot armor with what appears to be armor plating on the front to power armor, those swords would sure be effective against a literal walking tank...
The NCR has pretty much every type of weapon under the sun aside from energy weapons: .50 cals, rocket launchers, anti-aircraft guns, miniguns, large caliber handguns, shotguns, the legion uses powerfists, machetes, bumper swords, occasionally small arms, and ballistic fists. Aside from numbers, the Legion is entirely outclassed.

Yeah I really don't see the Legion ever winning, sure they're persistent but that doesn't do jack shit when you have missiles striking you and soldiers shooting you with rifles while the only protection you have on is football armor.

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themaster96



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PostSubject: Re: who'd win the battle of Hoover Dam without the couriers intervention?   Sat Jun 27, 2015 7:20 pm

@PoisonEliteGaming wrote:
@jkdsh wrote:
Really? People are actually saying the legion would win?
They have what, two types of legionaries that carry guns and even then they're usually shotguns or handguns and the occasional hunting rifle? Yes, numbers are important, but, so is having an equalized amount of technology and weaponry. The NCR could literally send two vertibirds and the Legion would be boned, a heavily armored airborne vehicle with missiles and miniguns, that leather football armor will definitely save them from that, right? That leads into the next part, armor, NCR troops have everything from riot armor with what appears to be armor plating on the front to power armor, those swords would sure be effective against a literal walking tank...
The NCR has pretty much every type of weapon under the sun aside from energy weapons: .50 cals, rocket launchers, anti-aircraft guns, miniguns, large caliber handguns, shotguns, the legion uses powerfists, machetes, bumper swords, occasionally small arms, and ballistic fists. Aside from numbers, the Legion is entirely outclassed.



Yeah I really don't see the Legion ever winning, sure they're persistent but that doesn't do jack shit when you have missiles striking you and soldiers shooting you with rifles while the only protection you have on is football armor.

Like i said in a world with weapons of mass destruction numbers and persistency doesnt matter
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